Grothe Thinks Players Deserve A Cut Of Sales

[IncrediBULL]

Well your right bull dozer, but the football players don't just get their degrees. They have to perform in the class room as well.

Actually a good portion of them do.   So what's the difference between the kids that do and the ones that don't?  Simple It's how seriously they take the class room.  Some kids do just enough to get eligible some seriously work towards graduating, why should we reward the ones that are just here to stay eligible and play football?  If you gave someone a free car and they wrecked it by being reckless would you pay for the repairs?    

You kind of lost me there. If players do badly in their classes, they don't play football..

If a player does terrible, yes, they cannot play.  but if a player does enough to stay on the team, meets minimum standards, they may graduate but they won't get any extra funds.   Players who do very well are entitled to other scholly's which may allow them to pocket some money for other things as an adder (not sports related, but academic related).   So a smart athlete can in fact make money.

[IncrediBULL]

This will never happen... if players strike which is the only way to try and force their hand then we the fans loose, and the colleges will just draft from the student body to replace them or not play at all.

It would also be a death blow to more football programs out there than most realize.  Unless it's done with revenue sharing you would see some programs fold up due to not having the extra $$$ to pay the players.  Not every athletic department has coffers overflowing with money which is why you see some programs do 3 or more "pay day" games a season and thats just to support the other programs and keep the budget in the black. 

You're acting like football programs don't make any money at all. Athletic departments need to stop being so money-hungry.

I think everyone here that believes players should get payed more need to take a class at USF called Issues in Sport.  It's online, it has commentary from Lee Roy Selmon and many star players and coaches in football, and it explains what a problem it is to pay players, among many other things.

Responding to this quote specifically:  most athletic programs DON'T MAKE MONEY.  Most D1 Football programs don't make money, and those that do use the money to pay for every other athletic program around the campus.  There are very few that receive enough money to have an excess in budget.

Furthermore, college athletes are eligible for academic scholarships, too.  Playing football is the same as another student having a job on the side, except YOU GET TO PLAY FOOTBALL.  If your grades are good, you also get academic scholarships and grants.  Honors gives money every semester, as well.

If your family is not well off, you get a Pell Grant of up to $2000 a semester.  Just fill out a FAFSA and the check comes to you.

As Greg pointed out:  if you give money for Jersey sales you create a situation where a booster can buy thousands of them to resell and give that money to the player immediately.  That gives USC even more money to spend on players.  I don't think any of us want that.  Rich get richer, poor get...you get the idea.

As others have stated, if you were to compensate players (even more than the athletic scholarship which is in addition to potential academic scholarships and government grants), you'd have to give each player the same amount across the country.  If you give everyone that amount that plays sports (because you can't just give it to football players) then the athletic departments make even less money.  And again, most don't make money overall.

Issues in Sport is a great class if you need 3 easy credits and want to learn about sports ethics.

To your point, if that happens then the guys start getting agents and shopping schools for the best situation.  Okay, which school will promote me over another player so I can sell more jerseys and merchandise.  What about hats, or banners, or otehr things with my name.  Then it gets way out of hand....

Keep that **** out of the game.  It will screw things up big time.....  I hope the NCAA never opens the door up to this crap.

[Bull Dozer]

Well i wouldn't call it a salary, they are not professionals. They should get "living expenses"

Free room and board isn't enough living expenses?

I think every athlete at a University should get some kind of compensation. Iif you're on an academic scholarship, there are expectations, you keep your grades up, you continue to get the money.

As an athlete (and I really want to separate this just from football), you have to keep your grades up, you have to dedicate a lot of time, and there really is no guarantee that you keep your scholly. I know of two people that went through the USF softball program who signed with other colleges, their coaches left, the new coach came in, and they were cut...scholarship gone.

If it's not a guaranteed scholarship, then something else needs to be there. These kids can't work a real job like the other 40,000+ students at USF.

I don't know a solution for it, funny though, I wrote a paper on this when I was at USF. English professor at the time was very impressed and it opened a lot of eyes of people in my class on how much the athletes do in order to earn a scholarship.

...also, not every baseball, softball, soccer, tennis, etc. player is on a full scholarship. The money gets split up a lot to make sure that everyone gets some help. So, those kids aren't getting a completely free ride.

Again, this isn't a football issue, it is a global NCAA athlete issue, it's hard to look at that way since we get so caught up in football, but consider the other sports, and you may start to change your opinion a bit.

Bottom line, like Bulliever said, why are they asking Grothe these types of questions. He's a kid, probably wasn't prepared for this line of questioning, and why is it relevant to what they are doing. Ask those things in the off season or not at all.

If we start paying athletes expect a lot of those other/smaller sports to disappear.  Football and/or basketball carry the $$$ workload in most athletic departments including money that does go to supporting those other sports.  The smaller sports will get cut first seeing as they bring in less or in some cases no revenue (basic business).   The first kids to suffer will be the kids on those smaller teams because the money that used to pay for their equipment partial scholly's etc will now be going to pay a stipend.  Again without revenue sharing this will not work and good luck getting the presidents of some of the larger athletic departments to agree to that.    

[Bull Dozer]

This will never happen... if players strike which is the only way to try and force their hand then we the fans loose, and the colleges will just draft from the student body to replace them or not play at all.

It would also be a death blow to more football programs out there than most realize.  Unless it's done with revenue sharing you would see some programs fold up due to not having the extra $$$ to pay the players.  Not every athletic department has coffers overflowing with money which is why you see some programs do 3 or more "pay day" games a season and thats just to support the other programs and keep the budget in the black. 

You're acting like football programs don't make any money at all. Athletic departments need to stop being so money-hungry.

I think everyone here that believes players should get payed more need to take a class at USF called Issues in Sport.  It's online, it has commentary from Lee Roy Selmon and many star players and coaches in football, and it explains what a problem it is to pay players, among many other things.

Responding to this quote specifically:  most athletic programs DON'T MAKE MONEY.  Most D1 Football programs don't make money, and those that do use the money to pay for every other athletic program around the campus.  There are very few that receive enough money to have an excess in budget.

Furthermore, college athletes are eligible for academic scholarships, too.  Playing football is the same as another student having a job on the side, except YOU GET TO PLAY FOOTBALL.  If your grades are good, you also get academic scholarships and grants.  Honors gives money every semester, as well.

If your family is not well off, you get a Pell Grant of up to $2000 a semester.  Just fill out a FAFSA and the check comes to you.

As Greg pointed out:  if you give money for Jersey sales you create a situation where a booster can buy thousands of them to resell and give that money to the player immediately.  That gives USC even more money to spend on players.  I don't think any of us want that.  Rich get richer, poor get...you get the idea.

As others have stated, if you were to compensate players (even more than the athletic scholarship which is in addition to potential academic scholarships and government grants), you'd have to give each player the same amount across the country.  If you give everyone that amount that plays sports (because you can't just give it to football players) then the athletic departments make even less money.  And again, most don't make money overall.

Issues in Sport is a great class if you need 3 easy credits and want to learn about sports ethics.

Yup, there are definitely some people in this thread that need to take that class. The class is as guaranteed A and will open your eyes to lots of things that are sports related and rarely talked about elsewhere. 

[Bull94]

Pay the Players!! absolutely. did anybody see that monster contract the SEC just signed? does anybody think it's wrong that corey brewer played at UF while his parents lived in a dilapidated trailer while his coach pulls in $3.5M a year? Granted he went on to the NBA but most don't.

All BCS schools should set up a fund where a scholarship player for a revenue producing sport is given a $10k (at least) bonus for graduating. 25 graduates a year for football = $250k. Our head coach makes well over a million dollars.

How much do some of these coaches get paid (Millions) and yet they have kids that come from poor families that work their tails off for little or nothing.

If they don't go pro, so what.  They got a free education.  More than those of us with much better grades can say.  Their opportunity is a free education.  FOr the 99% who won't go pro, that is what their focus should be.  It is not a college team's problem someones family lives in a crappy trailer.  That is their own fricken fault.   We are not a nation who gives free crap to everyone who doesn't have things.  People in the US have to work for what they ahve, and all have an equal opportunity.  Unless we elect Obama, then you can be sure those of us with jobs will work harder to pay the taxes so more people can live on fricken welfare.  Nothing like  a free handout and sitting on your a$$ all day.  Makes me want to puke.

The school makes out way better than the players. By the way this is as socialist a system as you can find. the players bring in Millions and millions of dollars to support outrageous coaches salaries, A.D. salaries, althetic scholarships for non revenue producing sports, etc.

How is it fair that some kid on golf scholarship gets his education paid for by football revenue ? Or outrageous coaches salaries are paid indirectly by the players that bring in the revenue from the fans who watch them on the field? That's socialism at it's finest.

BCS schools are bringing in Billions of dollars from these athletes. They are indentured servants. Definition according to wiki:

An indentured servant is a form of debt bondage worker. The laborer is under contract of an employer for some period of time, usually three to seven years, in exchange for their transportation, food, drink, clothing, lodging and other necessities.

[Bull Dozer]

Pay the Players!! absolutely. did anybody see that monster contract the SEC just signed? does anybody think it's wrong that corey brewer played at UF while his parents lived in a dilapidated trailer while his coach pulls in $3.5M a year? Granted he went on to the NBA but most don't.

All BCS schools should set up a fund where a scholarship player for a revenue producing sport is given a $10k (at least) bonus for graduating. 25 graduates a year for football = $250k. Our head coach makes well over a million dollars.

How much do some of these coaches get paid (Millions) and yet they have kids that come from poor families that work their tails off for little or nothing.

If they don't go pro, so what.  They got a free education.  More than those of us with much better grades can say.  Their opportunity is a free education.  FOr the 99% who won't go pro, that is what their focus should be.  It is not a college team's problem someones family lives in a crappy trailer.  That is their own fricken fault.   We are not a nation who gives free crap to everyone who doesn't have things.  People in the US have to work for what they ahve, and all have an equal opportunity.  Unless we elect Obama, then you can be sure those of us with jobs will work harder to pay the taxes so more people can live on fricken welfare.  Nothing like  a free handout and sitting on your a$$ all day.  Makes me want to puke.

The school makes out way better than the players. By the way this is as socialist a system as you can find. the players bring in Millions and millions of dollars to support outrageous coaches salaries, A.D. salaries, althetic scholarships for non revenue producing sports, etc.

How is it fair that some kid on golf scholarship gets his education paid for by football revenue ? Or outrageous coaches salaries are paid indirectly by the players that bring in the revenue from the fans who watch them on the field? That's socialism at it's finest.

BCS schools are bringing in Billions of dollars from these athletes. They are indentured servants. Definition according to wiki:

An indentured servant is a form of debt bondage worker. The laborer is under contract of an employer for some period of time, usually three to seven years, in exchange for their transportation, food, drink, clothing, lodging and other necessities.

Except indentured servants don't have a chance to get degrees that are directly linked to greater earning potential for free.  Please stop being so dramatic. 

[Bull94]

Pay the Players!! absolutely. did anybody see that monster contract the SEC just signed? does anybody think it's wrong that corey brewer played at UF while his parents lived in a dilapidated trailer while his coach pulls in $3.5M a year? Granted he went on to the NBA but most don't.

All BCS schools should set up a fund where a scholarship player for a revenue producing sport is given a $10k (at least) bonus for graduating. 25 graduates a year for football = $250k. Our head coach makes well over a million dollars.

How much do some of these coaches get paid (Millions) and yet they have kids that come from poor families that work their tails off for little or nothing.

If they don't go pro, so what.  They got a free education.  More than those of us with much better grades can say.  Their opportunity is a free education.  FOr the 99% who won't go pro, that is what their focus should be.  It is not a college team's problem someones family lives in a crappy trailer.  That is their own fricken fault.   We are not a nation who gives free crap to everyone who doesn't have things.  People in the US have to work for what they ahve, and all have an equal opportunity.  Unless we elect Obama, then you can be sure those of us with jobs will work harder to pay the taxes so more people can live on fricken welfare.  Nothing like  a free handout and sitting on your a$$ all day.  Makes me want to puke.

The school makes out way better than the players. By the way this is as socialist a system as you can find. the players bring in Millions and millions of dollars to support outrageous coaches salaries, A.D. salaries, althetic scholarships for non revenue producing sports, etc.

How is it fair that some kid on golf scholarship gets his education paid for by football revenue ? Or outrageous coaches salaries are paid indirectly by the players that bring in the revenue from the fans who watch them on the field? That's socialism at it's finest.

BCS schools are bringing in Billions of dollars from these athletes. They are indentured servants. Definition according to wiki:

An indentured servant is a form of debt bondage worker. The laborer is under contract of an employer for some period of time, usually three to seven years, in exchange for their transportation, food, drink, clothing, lodging and other necessities.

Except indentured servants don't have a chance to get degrees that are directly linked to greater earning potential for free.  Please stop being so dramatic.   

yeah you're right. indentured servants were given a piece of the land they worked on for the specified period of time which would allow them greater earning potential in the future.

either way they both brought in substantial earnings without being paid.

[Bull Dozer]

How often were indentured servants actually released from their servitude? Very rarely.  Also an NCAA athlete is free to go at anytime while and indentured servant is not.  Most indentured servants were just slaves with a different title and very often generations of families would be trapped in the system by the debt of previous generations.  Yeah that sounds a lot like being an NCAA athlete  :

[BULLSHTR]

Think of the impact on recruiting...

Come to our school, we sold 15,000 Tebow jerseys this last year.  At USF, they only sold 1,000 Grothe jerseys. 

Come play at UF and make more money.

Yeah, that is a problem.

Best point yet

[BULLSHTR]

Unfortunately, even a 4 percent model sets up a system in which a booster can pay an amateur, and could even promise a specific payment before a recruit ever plays in a game..

Let's say USF wants Matt Grothe's little brother to come to USF. USF's coaches agree to market his jersey, and a wealthy booster buys 10,000 of them from an official USF retailer for $50 each, then resells them online for the same price. The star recruit suddenly has a $20,000 check, and all the booster had to do was invest $500,000 in retail he can resell.

It's a slippery slope once you make it OK for amateur athletes to be paid for their work as amateurs. Next there's a commission on billboards, for mentions in radio ads, etc ....

The players getting a cut of sales is a horrible idea. What do you think about each getting an equal flat rate though, Greg?